Risk... if a player has negative Debt... they should have the gold to donate back and leave the guild... that would be no problem... if they dont... then that person is using the guild, and should stay in there until they can say "i dont owe this guild anything... and im leaving"

if a player donates to a guild, and (for example)... has 200,000 in positive guild debt... it would ultimately up to the guild leaders if they want to reimburse the player some stuff... since "donations" are donations... and (logically)... if you donate something... you cant get it back... can you?

They probably wouldn't have the gold to give it back if they had spent it. What if I give someone armour and a helm? How much debt is that? Is it the full value of the items or the fifty percent they could get from selling it back to the store? If they can't give me it back I can treat them however I like and they can't get out until they raise the money from somewhere.

That's not a hard question to answer though and I'm telling you it would have to be fifty percent if that is all they would be able to get for it from the store. But maybe I gave them some gold and they gave it to a friend to help them out and the friend isn't around now to give it back or won't give it back.

Sure, a donation is a donation and you shouldn't expect to get it back. That's my point. If I give someone that joins my guild something unless we agree that it's only a loan I don't expect to get it back, just like they can't expect to get gold back that they donate to my guild. I'm running a guild and not a bank.

I'm just trying to make a point. Luke can implement this if he thinks it's a good idea but even though it's anoying that there are so many people that just take and don't give anything back I still don't think I would need something that says, "Welcome to my guild friend. Here's something to help you out but I don't really trust you so we are just calling it a loan for just now and you can't leave until you have paid it off." Now, I can see advantages to your suggestion because it's a way to keep everything above board and everybody knows who is getting what but all of that was there before on the guild news page and all your idea does is to calculate the balance and prevent them from leaving. I'm just saying that I didn't run a guild like it was a business and a hell of a lot more were joining my guild than were joining those ones that made it about money and said you get so much gold for joining and you pay so much tax once you are in. Well, I didn't do it that way anyway and they kept joining. I don't even know why they kept joining but they did and most of them stayed. None of them actually left straight away after I had given them something. When they did leave I didn't say to them that I wanted the gold or weapons back that I had given them months ago. So, I still say that I could tell people that I don't do things that way and I'm not trying to trap anybody in my guild. And if I had enough gold to spare I could probably buy your guild if I ask your members how much they owe you. People don't like being in debt and if they stay in your guild for a while they don't think they owe you anything except maybe a thankyou for having me and for helping me out.

just think of guild as an organization, and the benefits to joining one is a service that organization provides. If you've benefited from joining, then you are in debt to that organization. That isn't too much to ask. No one is entitled to free stuff in the real world, then why would you expect to join the guild for free, not contribute to that guild in any way then complain about not getting anything?

Unless its a charity guild, chances are you will want to do something to help it grow, or help that group grow and in return they help you grow. I think the debt variable is a good idea. If you leave a guild with + debt, its like leaving any group in good grace.

If you got free stuff like gold and equipment from the guild, then its time you give something back to it before you take off. It's as simple as that.

It would be nice if players did want to put gold into their guild to repay the help they have recieved and to help others but the fact of the matter is that most of them don't.

Players do put gold back into the guild anyway if they are healing with the priest. When I had my last guild there were millions coming into the treasury through the priest. I also had friends that were in other guilds that kept giving me gold to help the people in my guild, although I stopped accepting those donations after a while because I didn't need them just like I didn't need guild members making donations that I could get in one or two rounds of monster battles. It was nice if someone did donate a few K sometimes as a gesture but if it's small change to me and a lot of money to them it's better that they just keep their gold. If I've got higher level players donating millions sometimes I can either keep that gold myself or use it to help the lower level players. If you have a lot of gold coming in it's pretty stupid and a bit mean to worry about a few K here and there that you gave away and maybe someone that you want to help won't take it if you are going to be like that about it.

You don't need to tell me to think of a guild as an organisation. I've already said that myself in other posts. Try organising one though. Maybe you did but I don't know who you are, so you maybe came along after I left. Anyway, guilds were part of the feudal system in the Middle Ages and they were replaced by capitalism and the free market because that is a more efficient system. Okay, it's a fantasy game so there are antiquated things like guilds in it. That doesn't mean they are going to work though because the kids that play this game don't want to be ordered around by a master and the most you can do is to try to be a friend to them and they might be grateful and not stab you in the back like most people in this game will do the first chance they get.

The guilds were charaties. That's the truth about it. They were a sad little ego trip for the people that tried to run them and a bit of a joke to everybody else. The better ones could be fun to be in and maybe you could even learn something from the people in them sometimes. If someone joins my guild and makes posts on the notice board or helps the other members in any way, even if it's just being a friend to them, then they have done their bit and they don't need to give me back the sword I gave them. I'm not bothered about a little gold if I have millions and I can help someone out that needs it. I played the game to make friends and have a bit of harmless fun. I'm not so sad that I want to try to order a bunch of kids around that won't take any notice of me if I try that anyway. You do what you want with your guilds though and maybe Luke will give you this thing to give you a bit of control. You might even be able to find some poor saps that will join your guild and let you tell them what to do.

I'm just not into that ego trip, so I can't agree with you guys about this. That doesn't matter though. What I say about these things isn't important. If more is done to actually make guilds worth being in there might be some point in these measures you want to introduce to stop people from leaving them. I wouldn't join one in the first place unless the armies are coded and all of that is properly integrated into the game, or unless there is something else brought in to make guilds more than just an ego trip.

I think the number of Guilds you have been in should be noted somewhere on your profile...Then we can grief the guild hoppers lol.

The truth is that people kept leaving your guilds because they were crap and they didn't want you trying to order them about.

You could put something on profiles that tell you if somebody has tried a few guilds but all that might prove is that they are all shite and they haven't found one worth being in yet.

I feel that people should be able to trade freely between each other. I don't think there should be any limit as to how much someone wants to give to another person as it would be similar to Runescape in that regard.

Now, when I say that a limitation on "gifting" would be similar to Runescape, I mean that Runescape has a VERY similar system. It's annoying to trade an item while making profit at the same time.


How would gold donations even hurt the game?